I've come to the conclusion that our discussion here has not only ruffled feathers, but also possibly provided some that are looking for it free labor. I suggest that we now put togather some sort of document that contains our beliefs and PUBLISH IT ACROSS MULTIPLE SITES so that no derivative work can be published, that might claim some sort of authority that will possibly limit us in the future.
Any takers to produce the first draft?

I've not currently got time to do the up front...though I'd say some of it is done in the ACP threads. Someone do this quickly, please. Lets not be too specific either, anything specific will limit us.

Icabod

I'm deep into the definitive climbing book. Brian Kotwica has started illustrations too. Anyone else up to this task?

ummmmmmmmmmmm..................

Rushing into "publication" before several iterations of reviews and comments could be a disaster.

Besides, is anyone even doing anything toward creating "standards" or "best practices" or "good ideas" or whatever it/they wil be called? There seems to have been no activity recently.

Once it is published, there's no calling it back.

Don't worry about anyone deriving from our efforts. It's so uncooked right now. Think of this as similar to open source software. It's being built in public by volunteer contributors. We'll come to agreement as to when it is ready for wide distribution. And even when we reach that point it will continue to be an evolving document. It will not be set in stone once it's published. It will be version 1.1.

There should be no rush to publish. We want to move it a long but we shouldn't create artificial pressure. Quality work takes time. If some person or group takes material and claims the mantle of authority, their credibility will be zero. And their derived standard will be outdated quickly when version 1.2 etc. guidelines are released.

I'd like to propose that individuals volunteer to take on a first draft of a particular section (ACP Carabiners for example). This will move us towards our goal.

We're all very busy with work and other responsibilities, let's just keep it moving.
-moss

Thanks, Moss. I like your analogy of this effort being similar to open-source code.

I do have to wonder, though, about this concept of “mantle of authority” (or similar term) that has been used a few times. With all due respect, I don’t think anyone, including TCI, can claim any “authority.”

Please don’t misunderstand--I am implying absolutely nothing negative about TCI. It’s just that it seems quite presumptuous for *any* RTC group to assume that they have authority.

I can only presume that when Moss says, “If some person or group takes material and claims the mantle of authority, their credibility will be zero,” he also refers to TCI. Authority cannot be assumed; it must be earned.

Now I know that some will think I am fighting for those despicable rogue climbers who are so very negative and always trying to sabotage things. Nonsense: When a devil’s advocate (yours truly) causes us to carefully examine what we are doing, we all benefit from the resulting improved outcome.

My reason for asserting that (about the mantle bearer) is that we are so young that we have a fairly long climb to make, proving ourselves as we go, before anyone is presented with that mantle. (I very much am willing to enter into a discussion on this--I’m willing to be convinced otherwise.)

For example, what if TCI published standards, and then, a few days later, Dancing With Trees published standards that are unquestionably better by anyone’s measure? Would you say that Genevieve had zero credibility just because she published second? Would TCI jingoes then shout, “We were there first! We must be better!”

Comments?